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Thread: i think this is huge

  1. #1
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  2. #2
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    If it holds up I agree.

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    AKA Tony Arkitect FFF's Avatar
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    Oof. This is getting ugly.

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    Very strange stuff.

    Imagine someone came up to you and told you that you weren't man enough to compete in the men's weightlifting divisions, based on your testosterone levels, and that you have to compete against women because they are more in line with what some tests show? How soul destroying would that be as a person, regardless of the impact on your athletic career? This isn't about transgender athletes and pre op/post op individuals, but just supposedly regular individuals who have abnormally high or low hormone production rates. Think about that for a second.

    I mean, women and men get tested for adverse T levels all the time, but I believe that's in comparison to another hormone, and its the T/E ratio rather than raw testosterone. If someone has that ratio in sync, who is to judge their gender? Do they have a penis or a vagina from birth? That's kind of what should decide it.

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    * Blasting every PED under the Sun while training, then coming off, entering a comp and being able to pass a drug test: ok.

    * Blasting every PED under the Sun and coming back to compete after a 4 year ban: ok.

    * Living life as a man then dialing back test levels for 18 months then competing against women: ok.

    * Being born a woman and happening to have higher natural testosterone than other women: life ban.

    Got it.

    The victimization of this poor woman is disgraceful.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkpeter View Post
    * Blasting every PED under the Sun while training, then coming off, entering a comp and being able to pass a drug test: ok.

    * Blasting every PED under the Sun and coming back to compete after a 4 year ban: ok.

    * Living life as a man then dialing back test levels for 18 months then competing against women: ok.

    * Being born a woman and happening to have higher natural testosterone than other women: life ban.

    Got it.

    The victimization of this poor woman is disgraceful.
    I may be mistaken, but I believe she is biologically intersex (female genitalia, testicles instead of ovaries). She is the actual grey area. I would hate to be responsible for making this decision, but it is ambiguous.

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    The only openly transgender athlete in weightlifting just bombed in the snatch at the Arafura Games. Which effectively ends any chance she’ll get to the Olympics (since she didn’t compete in any other qualifying tournaments in the first qualifying period).

    Apparently the participation of ambiguous athletes is only controversial when they win.
    Last edited by Cleddau; 05-01-2019 at 05:54 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cleddau View Post
    The only openly transgender athlete in weightlifting just bombed in the snatch at the Arafura Games. Which effectively ends any chance she’ll get to the Olympics (since she didn’t compete in any other qualifying tournaments in the first qualifying period).

    Apparently the participation of ambiguous athletes is only controversial when they win.
    There was plenty of controversy around Laurel. The fact that she was a long shot for the podium and never going to set world records makes her less so. She is a master's athlete who had a background in the sport pre-transition. Had she tranisitioned earlier and crushed her competition, it would be a different story, but a 35+ year old having a short international career isn't much to write about. More of a miracle that her body could put up with the necessary training volume.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason Bourgeois View Post
    I may be mistaken, but I believe she is biologically intersex (female genitalia, testicles instead of ovaries). She is the actual grey area. I would hate to be responsible for making this decision, but it is ambiguous.
    I think you are correct about Semenya, but regarding being 'the actual grey area'....... the point I was essentially making is that contextualized with the other examples of known PED users and trans athletes being able to compete, Semenya and any future athlete like her, has to eat a life ban.

    Why she should be the grey area, and not PED users or trans-athletes is extremely unfair.

  12. #10
    Member Judas's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hawkpeter View Post

    * Living life as a man then dialing back test levels for 18 months then competing against women: ok.
    Uhhh... this had better NOT be okay. Please tell me they did not, do not allow this. I read about the NZ 'woman' cleaning house, and just recently powerlifting had a masters 'woman' clear out all the records there too. That... is bullshit. No amount ov steroids over any amount ov time will give a woman a chance against a man-turned-woman. Not even close. I thought they shot this shit down? If they didnt? Thats the death ov women's sport, period.

    Men compete against men.

    Women compete against women.

    Men who are now women compete against men.

    Women who are now men (who have TUES for actual steroids) compete against men.

    OR... create a transsexual division/league.


    There is NO other way. Might not be fair to the trannies, but that is only the beginning ov their problems in life. Fucking EVERY other woman in the sport to be "fair" to one person is beyond fucking asinine. Sorry. Not everyone gets to play.

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