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Thread: Adults should not do weightlifting, says Functional Training Guru Michael Boyle

  1. #21
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    I actually agree if you take this from a certain perspective. If you have people wanting to get fit, put on a bit of muscle, lose some fat, and they have shocking mobility, flexibility and posture, there is no real need to snatch and clean and jerk. Someone's 50 year old dad would probably be better served doing more basic strength exercises for the rest of his life rather than trying to do snatch and c&j for some reason. They can do it, and of course it is admirable if they do and be able to do the movements well enough, but it would not be my first thought coaching certain groups.

    Also keep in mind that this guy is very much in favour of kids and younger people doing weightlifting.
    Last edited by CNL; 06-12-2019 at 04:42 AM.

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  3. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matt Erdman View Post
    I stopped reading his stuff years ago.

    Question: If you lack the athleticism to perform the lifts properly, how are you going to be a great athlete in other sports?
    One of the guys in my gym ran in the 800m in Rio, he has bad posture and bad upper body mobility, so he cant snatch or clean well, does that make him a bad or non-great athlete?

    His best 800m run time is 1:47, for reference!

    We all love weightlifting but I don't think every athlete needs to be able to do it and not every average joe should be pushed to do it.
    Last edited by CNL; 06-12-2019 at 04:50 AM.

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  5. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by CNL View Post
    I actually agree if you take this from a certain perspective. If you have people wanting to get fit, put on a bit of muscle, lose some fat, and they have shocking mobility, flexibility and posture, there is no real need to snatch and clean and jerk. Someone's 50 year old dad would probably be better served doing more basic strength exercises for the rest of his life rather than trying to do snatch and c&j for some reason. They can do it, and of course it is admirable if they do and be able to do the movements well enough, but it would not be my first thought coaching certain groups.

    Also keep in mind that this guy is very much in favour of kids and younger people doing weightlifting.
    Boyle's focus is on training athletes. He doesn't believe in full squats, but will have his athletes do heels elevated goblet squats with a kettlebell -- not much overload there.

  6. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by CNL View Post
    One of the guys in my gym ran in the 800m in Rio, he has bad posture and bad upper body mobility, so he cant snatch or clean well, does that make him a bad or non-great athlete?

    His best 800m run time is 1:47, for reference!

    We all love weightlifting but I don't think every athlete needs to be able to do it and not every average joe should be pushed to do it.

    First, talent prevails. For sprinters, those with long tendons tend to excel. Perhaps he is fast despite his mobility problems and posture, and would run even faster if these areas were improved upon (and the Olympic lifts are great for improving posture and mobility)? And this isn't a question of pushing people to lift, but responding to someone who says partial movements are better than full movements, and that the lifts are too difficult to teach.

  7. #25
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    Ah - let the record show I did not know he was talking about athletes, and that strange partial variations are superior to full range for them, or that the lifts cannot be taught to these folks.

    And yes, the guy I mentioned must have been an exceptional talent, regardless of anything else. But there is no reason why adding weightlifting (which would take something away from his recovery capabilities and potentially have to do less of the rest of his training) would certainly make him better, and the same with everyone else.

    With that in mind, if they aren't doing anything of the sport of weightlifting's basic training, then they will be at a deficit.
    Last edited by CNL; 06-13-2019 at 09:59 AM.

  8. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by CNL View Post
    Ah - let the record show I did not know he was talking about athletes, and that strange partial variations are superior to full range for them, or that the lifts cannot be taught to these folks.

    And yes, the guy I mentioned must have been an exceptional talent, regardless of anything else. But there is no reason why adding weightlifting (which would take something away from his recovery capabilities and potentially have to do less of the rest of his training) would certainly make him better, and the same with everyone else.

    With that in mind, if they aren't doing anything of the sport of weightlifting's basic training, then they will be at a deficit.
    It's been shown with track athletes that weight training can significantly reduce overuse injuries and total injuries, and this is especially true with young athletes who focus on just one sport. However, Boyle focuses on partial range movements. For example, on the cover of one of his books it shows a man performing a split squat such that the top of the front leg isn't even reaching parallel -- and this is the exercise that he says is superior to squats. These types of movements will reduce the elastic qualities of the tissues.

  9. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by CNL View Post
    One of the guys in my gym ran in the 800m in Rio, he has bad posture and bad upper body mobility, so he cant snatch or clean well, does that make him a bad or non-great athlete?

    His best 800m run time is 1:47, for reference!

    We all love weightlifting but I don't think every athlete needs to be able to do it and not every average joe should be pushed to do it.
    Obviously as things get into the endurance range, your training focus has to shift. Most athletes are playing sports that require explosiveness, and that is what they are looking to these coaches to help them train for. Weightlifting doesn't have much benefit to maintaining a sub-maximal pace in a mostly straight line.

  10. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheJonty View Post
    I thought that was just internet/social media discourse in general.
    Good point.

    Quote Originally Posted by Judas View Post
    Thing is about fitness/lifting... as well all know, it can utterly change lives. Drastically. So if some delusional shit finds a 3/10 'coach' and makes any gains to get them out ov their slob form, its still a drastic life change... and well, just like religion, people get stupid about it.
    Very true. I actually see this with general fitness people A LOT. They're like "My coach is awesome, they NEVER let me do anything wrong!" but because they personally have zero fitness knowledge, they don't know if their coach knows what he's doing or not.

  11. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by FFF View Post
    Good point.



    Very true. I actually see this with general fitness people A LOT. They're like "My coach is awesome, they NEVER let me do anything wrong!" but because they personally have zero fitness knowledge, they don't know if their coach knows what he's doing or not.

    You can smell the bullshit a mile away. An older out ov shape friend ov mine used to brag that his PT made him sooooooooooooo sore all the time. 'He's kicking my ass!' I told him i could grab an unloaded barbell, have him curl it 100 times and he'd curse me for a week... and it still wouldn't do a thing for him. My clients rarely get sore, ever... past the initial week obviously. People want to be lied to. They want excuses. They want to be weak and old. Why wouldn't they? Every face ov media glorifies weakness and stupidity now. What can you do?

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  13. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim Goss View Post
    Boyle's focus is on training athletes. He doesn't believe in full squats, but will have his athletes do heels elevated goblet squats with a kettlebell -- not much overload there.
    It makes sense if you think of his population. Rule 1 for training athletes is "don't hurt them in the weight room." Everything else is a secondary concern.

    Training athletes to squat/clean/SN/whatever properly requires time and technical knowledge that a lot of these guys don't have. It's easier (and safer) to program box jumps, agility drills, and landmine exercises.

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